Spiritual Forum

Replies

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  Ara October 12, 2023 at 4:56pm

  

  http://me-confidential.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/palestine-e14...
  a thousand years of conflict in that whole region, too much water under the bridge and the"europe" bullies - bad for all. Just look at the map
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  Roaring Lovely October 12, 2023 at 10:47am

  As for the 'beheaded babies' claim, I have read from RT news that white house has denied this and Israel military has denied that there is any evidence such a thing happened! Yes Israel itself has denied other claims that have over-demonized Hamas!!!
  
  Put it simple, they were nothing but Biden's nonsense! So I wonder how comes you now quote Biden's propaganda and believe it!! But even more importantly, there is no way Hamas can be working with Biden if the latter smears them with such a damaging allegation! You cannot say 'biden is just pretending' because he absolutely don't need to go to that extent for mere pretence. Biden truely hate Hamas has he hates Russia!
  
  You just cannot use the logic that 'since trump hate Hamas, then Biden (or Obama) likes them'! Political opponents does not mean political mirror opposites!
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    Drekx Omega > Roaring Lovely October 12, 2023 at 10:51am

    

    Israeli coroner service has confirmed the beheaded babies story...And IDF soldiers were in tears over this matter and the small bodies were wrapped up in bags, for removal....This is not Biden's view, but the view of Israelis on the ground...
    
    See this vid on the matter....:
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKtTYgfvM9k
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      Roaring Lovely > Drekx Omega October 12, 2023 at 1:25pm

      

      It is not RT news alone that has reported this. It is everywhere! This news has been debunked! It seems to have been some Israeli media propaganda!
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  Drekx Omega October 12, 2023 at 8:12am

  I keep having to remind you that there is a conflict going on in America itself, between those who seek a global role for America and those who want a peaceful America that does not get involved in EVERY FOREIGN ADVENTURE.....
  If you assume that globalism is winning this dispute, you are wrong...
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  Drekx Omega October 12, 2023 at 8:06am

  

  I'm disputing their methods, which have become barbarism, pure and simple..
  As for the history of the Israel-Palestine conflict, the PLO and George Habbash's PFLP, at least used tactics and methods that one could suggest are legit resistance methods...Albeit, our modern aviation industry has been destroyed by excess security, caused by such hijackings, in the 1970s...
  When you watch the old news reels of travel on board airliners in the 1950s and 60s, they had so much more luxury then....So terrorism has an anti-civilisation consequence....Not good for anyone at all...
  
  Albeit, the PFLP were leftists, who actually sought national liberation....One could admire Palestinian audacity, then....BUT NOW....Their replacements are islamic maniacs, who deliberately target women and children...
  So I no longer favour their cause, as it has lost all legitimicy, as a result..
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    Roaring Lovely > Drekx Omega October 12, 2023 at 10:06am

    

    This way we don't disagree at all! I was only suspicious with your intent because I have never seen you condem Israel at all, even though they too uses wickedness persue their agenda. Israel is very notorious in shooting Palestinian children. This is indisputable fact. Actually I have no time to list all the examples but Israel's wickedess in Palestine is well documented. However, this doesn't mean Hamas is any good either. But what I am trying to emphasize here are:
    1.)Hamas and any other group need not be seen as homogeneous.
    
    If we cannot condem the whole of US because of Abu Grain incidence, (even though US tried to cover it), then it is even worse off to condemn a whole of a non-state actor. This is because it is even more difficult to enforce discipline on a crude kinda 'proto-, military '. So yes, not everything done by and Hamas, a Talibani etc combatant is commanded so or endorsed by every other Hamas member. However, due to the disperet need to unite against an immediate foe, the commanders etc try very hard not to initiate quarells within the ranks. So they can postpone the issue and they even often expell the unruly members. In other words, think of a non-state actor to be in some way, like any other state military.
    
    1.)There is a need to differentiate between a GOAL and a MEANS.
    
    I am glad you grasp this well! A goal can be very good, such as fight for independence, but a means can be very wicked. They were so even in fight against colonialism, and like I told you, May Maus for instance were never short of barbarisms that even shocked Kenyans themselves! Likewise the ultimate goal can be very wicked but those persuing it use canningly 'good' methods. This is how colonists persued their wicked aims!
    
    3.)need not to forget the state of the Palestinians
    
    They are stateless pple since Israel don't allow them to be citizens in Israel nor allow them to form their own state. So how are they to enjoy the benefits of state such as military defense and persuance of national interests? When they say 'Israel have a right to defend themselves', they never say Palestinians too have this right! Every group of people have a right to form their own state and their own military. Imagine if you were told that 'Ireland has a right to defend itself' but never told that England has this right as well! Worse is that they neither recognize England as a state nor allow it's citizens to be Ireland's!! The question is who will protect the pple of England? Do you agree that you never never need to protect yourself from Ireland?? If so, I dare every country to relinquish their statehood and trust their neighborhood county! No one in the world trust his neighbor to this extent and pple expect only the Palestinian s to do that!
    
    So when we judge Hamas remember that it is a group that emerges from a very perculia circumstance and no one else where has experience such! We don't know what kind of formidable force that England, for instance will forge to at least provide themselves with some sense of 'national military' (a thing everyone seems to need) if denied statehood by world powers!!
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      Drekx Omega > Roaring Lovely October 12, 2023 at 10:42am

      

      I will say that I have sympathised with Palestine, in the past and thought them justified in national resistance, when the PLO and PFLP were more salient...The Jordanians also found themselves at odds with Palestine and this led to "Black September." The Munich olympics massacre of Israeli athletes was evil and set back their cause, a lot......Looks like all have given up, apart from the islamic extremists, such as Hezbollah, Hamas and Islamic Jihad...No mention of any of the PLO Fatah groups, now..As they have obviously packed up their efforts, as not as insane as the Islamic groups..
      
      But over the years of observing this conflict I have understood the desperation on both sides..and yes I have condemned Israel, when they used white phosphorous attacks on civilians...
      BUT NOW.....I believe that the methods used by Hamas, have proven that they have no moral position....Israel does, for the time being..
      So I'm open minded, but not focussed on the past, just current events and current conclusions...
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        Roaring Lovely > Drekx Omega October 12, 2023 at 1:43pm

        

        PLO etc gave up fighting for Palestine, and that's the problem. This thing is funded by Israeli and US themselves. So it's kinda absurd to think that they can fight their own masters! This is the reason why Palestinians rejected PLO and voted for Hamas!
        
        To highlight this problem, the resent west bank incidence surfice. Just where is PLO etc when Israelis invade there, attack Palestinians disecrate Al Aqsa etc? This has led even the Palestinians in west bank desperate and have now rejected PLO. It seems that only the Hamas are forceful enough when needed!
        
        You got to understand that like any other army, Israel needs also to be detered militarily. It is naive to expect that 'they are the unique military in the world'. What could prevent US atrocities in Abu Grain? The answer is some deterance on the part of 'the enemy '. No fighting force should be allowed to just ran through unchecked. That is how Israel cannot invade Lebanon. Hezbollah has managed to deter Israel. So if you just call these groups capable of deterring Israel as 'extreemists' or 'insane' (the narrative of Israel itself', I am not sure what you want! An Israel that can move anywhere it wish in middle east with total impunity? Like any other government, Israel needs some degree of 'language of force'. This is the government's 'native language'!
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          Drekx Omega > Roaring Lovely October 12, 2023 at 4:11pm

          

          Frankly I'm amazed at the number of idiots in the western world, who are morally vacuous psyopaths, in support of the evil Hamas outfit...😖
          
          This recent event is about genocide against women and children, not just a long standing political dispute, between Israel and Palestine.....So, the past week has been a test of EVERYONE's moral veracity...Do readers stand with goodness, or evil...?? And being a fence sitter does not cut it.....
          
          And I'm sick of these hand-wringing woke liberals, who blame Israel and the Anglosphere, for just about everything and give a free pass to homicidal islamists and criminals....😠
          
          And the UK's voice of deep state mischief, is the well known BBC, who have again disgraced themselves, by not labeling Hamas as TERRORISTS, which they should have and also demonstrating bias in favour of Hamas....The BBC must be defunded by the UK taxpayer.....It's monopoly must come to an end...
          
          ENOUGH ALREADY........!!😑
          
          Some excellent points by the brilliant author, Douglas Murray☺️
          
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qw81d46yUD0